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Post by andersnm on Jul 21, 2020 18:19:29 GMT
Played a round today at Wade's new RCR. First of Wade - good job, and well done. I really like the textures and look - and the beach part is just perfect. I am however going to be a little nitpicky here - since you are on your way to be a very good RCR artist  Planting: I noticed a bit repetition on the tree selection - or am I wrong? It is not a big thing at all, but I would like a bit more variation. I do however really like your bush planting and overall planting. And another thing I like to do - is to fill in the outskirts with Auto-gen trees. That makes all the empty spaces around the course be filled with trees. After you have turned on the auto-gen trees in the designer, you need to clear all auto-gen trees with the remove generated trees from your course - but that is quickly done with a large brush. I played pinset one, and I think you have your pins too center on too many greens for my taste. It makes the course a bit more dull to play. So here is my advice on any courses that is or has been recently played on the PGA Tour. I use pgatourmedia.pgatourhq.com/ and scroll down on the schedule to find the tournament I am interested in. There you will find hole locations for all four rounds with exact yardages. So for this course - the link is: pgatourmedia.pgatourhq.com/tours/2020/pgatour/mayakobagolfclassic. Notice how rare it is to find the pin totaly center on the green. So when you port your course over to the new game - I would highly recommend to use these hole locations. As you don't have lidar data, it may be you need to re-sculpt the greens a bit for those locations. But that would be even more authentic for our event.  |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2020 16:35:09 GMT
andersnm Anders, as always I really appreciate your feedback and advice! My course was not approved. Tpetro said that it was a "poor rendition" mainly because my bunkers didn't look like the real version. He also said he has played the real course 3 times and my mangroves didn't look right. Here is the link and its the last few pages of the thread. tgctours.proboards.com/thread/400/courses-accepted-tgc-tours-feedbackIt seems really nitpicking as you say. I doubt I will design any more courses. I guess I'm just not good enough. I will try to update Mauna Kea and EL Camaleon and port them over when the new game comes out. Needless to say I was very disappointed when he said it was a poor rendition. I challenged him to play the other El Camaleon Mayakoba G.C. That course was approved and mine was not. Edit: to answer your question about the trees. The tree selection on the tropical them has about 3 main non-palm trees. They all look very similar. I did try to rotate them as I planted but they still look similar. I also made some a little bigger. I'm with you in that I don't like the same look on the course. It doesn't look realistic. That is great info about the pins. I just looked at the site and it's fantastic! I tried watching highlights for each round to see where the pins were located but they wouldn't show all the holes. They even have a scorecard for the tournament. I looked all over the internet trying to find one and couldn't.
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Post by andersnm on Jul 23, 2020 15:29:33 GMT
I think it is best to help each other to make better recreations (and for those that like fictional - make better fictional courses). The feedback you got as a reason for not having your recreation in the database is just a joke when we see all the other crap that are in that database - even marked as "tour worthy".
They are starting to thread a dangerous road if they set so high a standard for RCR's that this implies. If that is so - they need to cleanse the database of all the crap - and that would even mean decent/good recreations.
I hope you reconsider doing more stuff once the new game is out Wade. You are improving course by course - so all of us that wants good recreations would loose out if you stop. It is important to know that everyone can be better - and what we saw in how tips came from that bunker - that is the way to go. I got great feedback on Pebble Beach, and some tips and tricks I didn't know about, hopefully making my next coastal RCR better.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2020 19:03:03 GMT
I think it is best to help each other to make better recreations (and for those that like fictional - make better fictional courses). The feedback you got as a reason for not having your recreation in the database is just a joke when we see all the other crap that are in that database - even marked as "tour worthy". They are starting to thread a dangerous road if they set so high a standard for RCR's that this implies. If that is so - they need to cleanse the database of all the crap - and that would even mean decent/good recreations. I hope you reconsider doing more stuff once the new game is out Wade. You are improving course by course - so all of us that wants good recreations would loose out if you stop. It is important to know that everyone can be better - and what we saw in how tips came from that bunker - that is the way to go. I got great feedback on Pebble Beach, and some tips and tricks I didn't know about, hopefully making my next coastal RCR better. , I just happened to look at TGC course feedback thread. I can't tell you how happy it made me to see your reply in there. You worded it perfectly. I was actually working on El Camaleon, fixing the bunker and using the pin information you gave me. I think that is so awesome. Like you said it makes the immersion so much better. I am up to hole #4 setting pins, fixing trees and other minor stuff. I really tried to make the course look like the real one. To have Tpetro call it a poor recreation was disheartening. He wouldn't even play the other El Camaleon. He also told me he has played the real course 3 times. Somehow I have a feeling he has never even been to Mexico! |
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Post by andersnm on Jul 23, 2020 19:06:53 GMT
I think it is best to help each other to make better recreations (and for those that like fictional - make better fictional courses). The feedback you got as a reason for not having your recreation in the database is just a joke when we see all the other crap that are in that database - even marked as "tour worthy". They are starting to thread a dangerous road if they set so high a standard for RCR's that this implies. If that is so - they need to cleanse the database of all the crap - and that would even mean decent/good recreations. I hope you reconsider doing more stuff once the new game is out Wade. You are improving course by course - so all of us that wants good recreations would loose out if you stop. It is important to know that everyone can be better - and what we saw in how tips came from that bunker - that is the way to go. I got great feedback on Pebble Beach, and some tips and tricks I didn't know about, hopefully making my next coastal RCR better. , I just happened to look at TGC course feedback thread. I can't tell you how happy it made me to see your reply in there. You worded it perfectly. I was actually working on El Camaleon, fixing the bunker and using the pin information you gave me. I think that is so awesome. Like you said it makes the immersion so much better. I am up to hole #4 setting pins, fixing trees and other minor stuff. I really tried to make the course look like the real one. To have Tpetro call it a poor recreation was disheartening. He wouldn't even play the other El Camaleon. He also told me he has played the real course 3 times. Somehow I have a feeling he has never even been to Mexico! I am quite sure he meant he has played your recreation three times. Edit: though I can be wrong about that, because after re-reading his post, it could definitely mean he has played the real course three times. Anyway, good to see you got back to the designer Wade |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2020 19:27:14 GMT
andersnm , I just happened to look at TGC course feedback thread. I can't tell you how happy it made me to see your reply in there. You worded it perfectly. I was actually working on El Camaleon, fixing the bunker and using the pin information you gave me. I think that is so awesome. Like you said it makes the immersion so much better. I am up to hole #4 setting pins, fixing trees and other minor stuff. I really tried to make the course look like the real one. To have Tpetro call it a poor recreation was disheartening. He wouldn't even play the other El Camaleon. He also told me he has played the real course 3 times. Somehow I have a feeling he has never even been to Mexico! I am quite sure he meant he has played your recreation three times. Edit: though I can be wrong about that, because after re-reading his post, it could definitely mean he has played the real course three times. Anyway, good to see you got back to the designer Wade No, he told me he played the real course 3 times. That's why I think they are full of crap. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2020 19:29:54 GMT
andersnm , I just happened to look at TGC course feedback thread. I can't tell you how happy it made me to see your reply in there. You worded it perfectly. I was actually working on El Camaleon, fixing the bunker and using the pin information you gave me. I think that is so awesome. Like you said it makes the immersion so much better. I am up to hole #4 setting pins, fixing trees and other minor stuff. I really tried to make the course look like the real one. To have Tpetro call it a poor recreation was disheartening. He wouldn't even play the other El Camaleon. He also told me he has played the real course 3 times. Somehow I have a feeling he has never even been to Mexico! I am quite sure he meant he has played your recreation three times. Edit: though I can be wrong about that, because after re-reading his post, it could definitely mean he has played the real course three times. Anyway, good to see you got back to the designer Wade Just saw your edit. And I want to thank you again for your comments in the thread. I think you nailed it and they don't know how to answer you. I probably wouldn't have messed with the designer if it wasn't for your Pin info. I really do strive to make the course as accurate as I can. And using the correct pins will help. |
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Post by andersnm on Jul 23, 2020 19:36:25 GMT
I am quite sure he meant he has played your recreation three times. Edit: though I can be wrong about that, because after re-reading his post, it could definitely mean he has played the real course three times. Anyway, good to see you got back to the designer Wade Just saw your edit. And I want to thank you again for your comments in the thread. I think you nailed it and they don't know how to answer you. I probably wouldn't have messed with the designer if it wasn't for your Pin info. I really do strive to make the course as accurate as I can. And using the correct pins will help. I know you do your best - and one can expect nothing more. As I said - we can all be better, and the only way to be better is to share tips and tricks and learn as we go and from each other. And I would like to say that every recreation has flaws. Even the best. Not one recreation is perfect to real life. They do have a problem Because I am quite sure they have never set a standard for recreations - and it is all up to the reviewer. So they end up with approving bad recreations, and not approving good recreations. Which is confusing and totaly hopeless for those that are submitting. And I think this is due to the fact that their main focus is on fantasy courses. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2020 20:20:12 GMT
Just saw your edit. And I want to thank you again for your comments in the thread. I think you nailed it and they don't know how to answer you. I probably wouldn't have messed with the designer if it wasn't for your Pin info. I really do strive to make the course as accurate as I can. And using the correct pins will help. I know you do your best - and one can expect nothing more. As I said - we can all be better, and the only way to be better is to share tips and tricks and learn as we go and from each other. And I would like to say that every recreation has flaws. Even the best. Not one recreation is perfect to real life. They do have a problem Because I am quite sure they have never set a standard for recreations - and it is all up to the reviewer. So they end up with approving bad recreations, and not approving good recreations. Which is confusing and totaly hopeless for those that are submitting. And I think this is due to the fact that their main focus is on fantasy courses. I had to re-sculpt the first 3 greens as you said. I forgot to ask you if there is a youtube video on green sculpting. El Camaleon is a short course without a lot of elevations. I need to make the greens a little tougher without making them ridiculous. |
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Post by andersnm on Jul 23, 2020 20:36:49 GMT
I know you do your best - and one can expect nothing more. As I said - we can all be better, and the only way to be better is to share tips and tricks and learn as we go and from each other. And I would like to say that every recreation has flaws. Even the best. Not one recreation is perfect to real life. They do have a problem Because I am quite sure they have never set a standard for recreations - and it is all up to the reviewer. So they end up with approving bad recreations, and not approving good recreations. Which is confusing and totaly hopeless for those that are submitting. And I think this is due to the fact that their main focus is on fantasy courses. I had to re-sculpt the first 3 greens as you said. I forgot to ask you if there is a youtube video on green sculpting. El Camaleon is a short course without a lot of elevations. I need to make the greens a little tougher without making them ridiculous. This is the hard part without lidar data. I think you need to use google earth to get the major slopes (you can see elevation data in the bottom right along with coordinates). And you need to find as many pictures of the greens as you can to get an idea how they slope. I am not an expert at this by any means. I have done it when I tried to do recreations in the APCD (Links 2003). There was a technique to create textures of aerial images of the course, and then I could add verts and thus create the shapes in the APCD. After I had created all the shapes, I then needed to put in all the major slopes on the course from google earth data on elevation. And after that, it was all the fine-tuning on elevations around the course - and it was quite more work in moving all those verts around - so I never really finished any course in the APCD. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2020 17:52:34 GMT
El Camaleon GC-2019 Pins is published. Par 71 7017 yards.
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Post by andersnm on Jul 26, 2020 20:41:16 GMT
Had a round, and I must say Wade - Very good job! You have taken care of all my points, better pins (and also better greens) making this a much better experience, better planting and a great atmposphere on the course. The only thing I can nitpick on, is that you only have three tees. I had a look at the scorecard from El Camaleon, and they have 5 tees on the course in real life. When I plant the tees, I usualy use the scorecard and try to set the tees according to how they usualy are on the scorecard. It is not important to have exact yardages as they stand on the scorecard, because tees will be moved regurarly to allow the grass to grow again. I also use the same colors as they have on the scorecard.  |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2020 21:55:04 GMT
Had a round, and I must say Wade - Very good job! You have taken care of all my points, better pins (and also better greens) making this a much better experience, better planting and a great atmposphere on the course. The only thing I can nitpick on, is that you only have three tees. I had a look at the scorecard from El Camaleon, and they have 5 tees on the course in real life. When I plant the tees, I usualy use the scorecard and try to set the tees according to how they usualy are on the scorecard. It is not important to have exact yardages as they stand on the scorecard, because tees will be moved regurarly to allow the grass to grow again. I also use the same colors as they have on the scorecard. Thanks Anders for the great feedback! I almost did all the tees but I thought no one would use them. But it does make for a more authentic looking course. I did use the correct colors for the first 3 tee sets now I need to add the red and green tees. I might add the other tees before I port it to the new game. The 2019 pins you gave me really made a huge difference! I'm glad you enjoyed the course. I really liked how it finished up. Now if I can get booze to play it then I can see how bad he can shred it. lol ![]()  |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2020 17:25:15 GMT
andersnm I played your East Lake Tour Champ course. The course is fabulous! I was trying out my default PS4 controller instead of my usual scuf controller. The left thumbstick is like an Xbox controller on the scuf. It feels better but it keeps disconnecting from the ps4 and it's aggravating. I switched back to the dual shock but it will take some getting used to lol. Anyway, the course was fantastic and tough. I shot a +9 with my PS4 controller. I really enjoyed the course.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2020 23:15:46 GMT
andersnm just doing some touchups on the course in preparations to port. I added the other 2 tees and yardage is very close. I could go back and fiddle with the tees and get it closer but not necessary I guess. I used the official PGA scorecard for the Black Tees. I pretty much have it where I want it. Might do a few more small touches. I really like how it plays for my skill level. IRL the PGA winners have averaged around -20 for the tournaments there. I have been shooting right at -5 a round so I'm right there lol. It's a shame that this course is a poor rendition of the real one.  
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