Opinions on short game shots needed!

[jeff]

I’d like to get an opinion summarization of the short game shots in 2k21from the guys here that play a lot of golf IRL.

Robert pointed out in another post that the game struggles with useful and realistic between 20-45 yards.

Many are agreeing that partial pitches aren’t realistic even though the challenge is fun and pulling one off is satisfying. When would a partial pitch be appropriate IRL?

We’ve also agreed that the splash shot is to be used solely as a bunker shot, but was it designed that way? Would the game’s splash shot properly simulate another RL shot?

Same thing for flop and chip shots.

Even if these ideas aren’t incorporated into USE rules, I think it would be an interesting discussion. Selfishly, I want to pick your brains about short game shots as I head into retirement and will hopefully be golfing IRL a lot more.

TL;DR: IRL golfers please post opinions on what in-game shots most accurately simulate shots you would use IRL between 20-45 yards.

[mcbogga]

I think opinions will differ. I rarely play a stock pitch in my RL game, and that is probably a weakness but there are so many more options that are situationally better.


Im missing some go-to shots such as:

- The jump,skip and stop/trickle low shot that is great when having a lot of green to work with and getting to back pins on shelves. AKA the most satisfying shot in golf.

- The high drop and stop shot (neutral or slightly negative shaft lean with the LW using the bounce sort of like a bunker shot from the fairway). Requires the right sole on the wedge depending on soil and firmness but is a shot I use a lot from tight lies.

- The real Hail Mary full swing flop out of the rough that comes straight up. Can’t get any accuracy but it can usually drop the ball within 15 feet from stone dead and is sometimes the only option from deep lies over bunkers to fairly narrow greens. The splash kind of works for this but it’s not a proper flop.


That said - I haven’t really experimented with all the extremes of loft and attack angle in game so these shots may be possible. The issue with shaping is that the timing windows become a lot smaller which I think is not very realistic. It’s not like it’s significantly harder to hit any of the shots above, it’s just another type of shot / skill.

I really think that HB could do one thing to make the short-game shots a lot more realistic and remove the “auto-save” with the splash shot - don’t cap the distance at such low numbers. IRL you can easily send a “flop” or a “splash” 30-40 yards. So a good way would be to sort of force a partial swing on those shots and really ramp up the penalties on any swing going 20 yds or longer. Would probably be much more organic-feeling than what we have today....

[hammers1man]

Loft and deloft doesn't have a great impact on tempo bar or swing plane if you go no more than half way. It does work well for pitch and wedge shots or deloft for more of a pitch and run, both work well. You can loft your pitch up for a softer bounce and less roll out from rough.
The splash is a no brainer shot way too easy to get up and down with. It has identical ball mechanics when the ball hits the green from heavy rough or bunker. We will be looking at better thanTGC2019 scrambling percentages especially with the LW splash.
I played a career round today and got up and down 5 times from all different distance with the pitch shot. It is a feel shot the numbers mean nothing really and you know straight away when you have pulled off a good pitch shot from under 40 yards.

[mcbogga]

Yes, the LW splash is kind of broken from the rough, the SW and PW I think behave pretty much like a LW actually does from rough IRL. No large issue getting height, but spin is erratic at best.

I’m having a bit of a hard time with shot types overall in the short game, just not how I play golf around the greens IRL. It’s all about club delivery to manufacture a certain result for me.

[andersnm]

I think Robert, that we do many things the same, but we think of our approaches a bit different.

For me, it all starts with the basic chip shot. I use my lob wedge on all shots from 100 yards to the green - except in headwind where I may club up on the full shots.
The key to good short game for me, has always been to assess the lie. If I have a tight fairway lie, I need to adjust my stance accordingly and differently if the ball instead was sitting up in some light rough or higher fairway grass. Either way, a lob wedge of 58-60 degrees usualy creates enough loft that I rarely need to open the clubface.

So I use Mickelson's hinge and hold, and I need to feel for distance control with backswing length - and when I need it, I start to use body rotation on the shot - and it is at this point I call it a pitch - but in essense, all shots use the same technique, it is just a matter of how much force you need to put into the shot to get the distance needed. All I do in different lies, is to adjust my stance. If it is a tight lie, I lean a bit more forward - and in a fluffy lie, I have a neutral stance.

For me, the pitch shot and chip is all I need for most part, and the occasional flop. And then I like that I can change the angle of attack etc. The pitch in the game is capped at 1/2 swing. I am not a fan of this, I want the game to let me go futher back (and this is also true for the full swing, I want more than 105% overswing).

I have never seen the nuances of ball lies on the short game in any video golf game - and this is no different. And I think it will be some time before that. Let's face it, we are a small number that want realism to that level in a game.
But - and this is a major flaw for me in this game, and that is how the ball behaves from uphill and downhill lies. And this is just not realistic implementation in the game. So for me, the biggest issue on the short game is the ball flight from uneven lies. Also - grass between the ball and clubface is not a thing you want - so I would like it to be more unpredictable results from any heavy rough shots.

[jeff]

Good stuff so far, everyone! Thank you for the input!
🏌️‍♂️⛳️

[mcbogga]

Anders,

Yeah, same but different.

I’m a 100% feel player inside 75yds except for straight forward chips. All about lie and what shot the situation calls for. I love the intricacies of the short game.

Well, “feel” player might not be the right word as I have spent a lot of training time decomposing the components that go into shot creation and use them fairly rationally except maybe for my preference for the high shot and usually making stupid decisions when hitting into the grain from the rough.

Weight distribution, ball position, shaft lean, face angle and how it changes the sole interaction with the turf. Which wedge to use not mainly based on loft but bounce. shallow or steeper angle of attack. right hand drive thru ball or stronger left hand to hold the face. Finding the right combination to make the ball do what I want from the lie that I am given. No part of golf has more degrees of freedom.

I think the number one thing I wish they added into the game when it comes to the short game is grass direction, such a huge factor out of deep rough IRL.